A2A Simulations vs P3D

[wkhokhar]

Hi,

I'm new to this forum and new to simulation. I'm trying to find a good simulation software for my daughter. I read on the net that Plane X is better than P3D and at a different site someone was recommending A2A simulaitons. But when I check the A2A website. I found likes like C 172 (P3D).

I'm a bit overwhelmed by the info. Can someone advise, which simulation software to buy and which hardware controls like Yoke, rudder, TPM should I buy

Thanks
Waseem

[Smilin Jack]

Hello and welcome to the site!

I want to make sure you understand that A2A is not a stand alone simulator. They only provide add-on aircraft for use in FSX and/or P3D. You will still need one of those simulators in order to use A2A's aircraft. A2A does not offer any aircraft for use in X-Plane.

That being said, you will not find a better simulations of a light aircraft than what A2A offers! Having logged a considerable amount of hours in a real Piper Cherokee 180 I can honestly say that A2A's rendition of the Cherokee 180 is as close as your going to come to actually flying the real aircraft! Same goes for the Comanche, C182, and C172.

A2A's aircraft will spoil you and you'll rarely ever want to fly anything else in the sim.

Jack

[n421nj]

If youre looking for a realistic simulation get fsx or p3d and then download all A2A accusim planes

[Redglyph]

Both P3D/FSX and X-Plane are good, there isn't one better than the other, they just have their pros and cons. So you can't make a bad choice either way. That's the good news

Either simulator comes with very basic aircraft, and very basic places to fly them from and to. That's the bad news part, and so people buy add-ons to get good aircraft, good airports, more realistic weather, traffic and so on. P3D/FSX have a larger payware choice in that regards, and X-Plane has a lot of freeware available, which is good but not always of the same quality (it also has payware of high quality).

People usually start with general aviation aircraft, to learn the basics. You'll find good choices on both platforms, but my personal opinion is A2A's aircraft (only in FSX/P3D) are very good, they are passionate about what they do and you can see it in their documentation, in all the little details, and just by looking at the forums here. Look at the Accu-Sim series if you want a good start (Cessna 172 is a classic, for example). What's special to them, also, is they have a permanent state, so if you mistreat them, you'll have to replace parts more often. You don't often see that in other add-ons. Make sure to watch a few videos from them too (A2A Simulations, on Youtube), it'll be better than a thousand words. Or download the documentation of one of their aircraft, you'll see.

This is indeed a new world to discover and it will be somewhat overwhelming at first, watching a few videos is the best way to get to know it a little better. On Youtube, I'd recommend watching a few people like frooglesim, Peter Matthess, flightsim481, for example. Others will surely add to that list.

P3D is more or less compatible with FSX, Lockheed-Martin are extending it where Microsoft left it a while ago. Still, some licences restrict such and such module to either one of them, so be careful. There's also a compatibility issue, for example some of the A2A aircraft, like the P-51, is only guaranteed to work on FSX. It will also work on P3D - for now, no guarantee that it still will in the next version. Other older products just won't work anymore with P3D.

X-Plane is supposedly better on physics (though much argument can be read about those claims), and is a 64-bit program and does not suffer from memory limitations like P3D or FSX do. In a nutshell, you shouldn't see much difference if you choose P3D, they have optimized it enough so that memory issues don't happen unless in extreme cases.

There are other simulators too, but I think the only one worth mentioning regarding quality is DCS, which is a military simulator. Each of their aircraft is top-notch, but the maps are limited (currently a theatre around Georgia, another one around Nevada, one to come in Normandy) and ... it's military, so you won't find a Cessna there

You'll also have to think about the hardware, those aircraft cannot really be handled with a keyboard and a mouse, as you mentioned, but that probably depends on the level of realism you'd like to get, and which type of aircraft you'd like to fly.

PS: one last word, P3D has three types of licence, usually people take the academic licence, which will certainly apply to your daughter. As you can guess, it's cheaper, but the features are quite the same as the professional version. Lockheed-Martin will not ask you to send any document to prove you apply to that category.

[wkhokhar]

Thanks for taking time out for such comprehensive suggestions.

We are only interested in C 172 at the moment. Based on your suggestions, I think we are going to go with A2A+P3D. We'll also appreciate if you could recommend flight controls like Yoke, rudder, TPM. Does they come with feedback capabilities or are they just sticks and pulley.

But the way, this reply is for all who shared their suggestions. I'm not sure if this will get posted under any individual entry or to the mail question. Apologies for that.

Cheers
Waseem

[alehead]

When it comes to hardware in simulation, you always need to set yourself a budget. You see, entry level controllers are cheap, but if you aim for that little touch more realism, it will cost. Mid-level hardware involving yokes, pedals, etc are available from companies like Saitek, CH Products, Thrustmaster, and so on. There is very little on offer in terms of believable force feedback. Such load-increasing equipment is high end and relatively expensive.
Higher end equipment, including full generic panels are available from companies like Precision Flight Controls, Virtual-Fly, and so on. Full solutions can easily cost in excess of €5000... I currently use a Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS (hands on-throttle and stick), around €400, teamed up with MFG Crosswind pedals' around €320, and very soon a virtual-fly throttle quadrant, which cost around €720 with shipping. I also have two trim wheels from Saitek, each around €50 or so, I believe their best hardware product...

The joystick may not be the best in terms of realism when flying the Cessnas and Pipers here, but is is great for the warbirds and fast jets I have...
I would probably go for the PFC Saab yoke if I could afford it right now... One investment for the future...

Good luck with the setup. I believe you are making the right choice with A2A and the C172. It is great fun in it and rather convincing as far as I am concerned. Not that I have that much time at the controls of one in real life, only 2 or 3 hours at best, but the A2A takes me back... The support is excellent, the forum here is FULL of great tips, assistance, experience, and repaints, if you want your Cessna to have a different paint job...

Andrew


Andrew Entwistle

[crazac]

I think it depends on what you're trying to achieve and the experience you want for your daughter.

There are plenty of bells and whistles out there as ways to skin the cat.

I live in the US and have the Saitek Cessna Yoke, Pedals and 1 throttle quadrant. That does me well for the 172. And with the A2A product, gives a good immersion. That said, their VC is fully interactive, so I find it good to have to go to the dash to handle things. As opposed to having physical button dash in front of me.

[Paul K]

If you are just starting with flight simulations, I recommend you use the Steam-version of FSX and see how you get on. At the moment it's on the Steam site at £19.99, though they do reduce it occasionally as a special offer. I believe it comes with its own version of the Cessna 172, which would be good enough to start with. The A2A version of the C172 could be purchased later on.

As for hardware, get something basic to start with: a stick that has a throttle and twist-grip rudder, such as...

Saitek Cyborg 3D

Logitech Extreme 3D

Waseem, you say this is for your daughter - I don't know how old she is, but she might find the Logitech stick a little tiring after a while as the spring is a bit stiff. However, that stiffness does allow more precise control, in my experience. Also, if she is a youngster, you might want a stick that is adjustable for small hands, in which case the Saitek Cyborg would be a better choice.

All in all, if you are just starting out, keep it as basic as possible and only start adding new aircraft, scenery and so on, at a later date.

Ask again if you need more advice.

EDIT: Here's another Saitek stick you might consider - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uBj9R4YBWU. Again, it is very adjustable for hand size.

[wkhokhar]

Thanks guys. This is my first experience on any internet forum and you guys are really cool.

I've to admit though this is for my 12 year old daughter but I'm getting a bit excited myself. It is a good advise to stick to the basics first and see how her and may be my interest interest develops

One last thing. If I go to the A2A simulations shop and buy the A2A+P3D bundle. I will get both the licenses and will not have to go to the P3D website to buy it separately. Right?

Cheers
Waseem

[Oracle427]

The A2A store only sells the add on aircraft.

You will still need to purchase a license for either FSX or P3D as those are the simulation engines to which you may add on aircraft.

[wkhokhar]

Thanks everyone.

Cheers
Waseem

[Lewis - A2A]

Hello Waseem,

I see the guys have been firing lots of information at you for digestion.

I just wanted to ask if you are a Pilot yourself and if the sim is to be used as a hobby or as a training aid for you and your daughter?

thanks,
Lewis

[wkhokhar]

Hi guys,

I'm back again I did manage to procure P3D & A2A (C172). Went and bought Saitek Yoke, Quadrant and rudder. However, can't seem to configure the yoke and thorttle/mixture in the P3D. Any one has an easy configuration guide? URL?

I'm using Windows 10, P3D V3 and Accu-Sim C172 with Saitek controls.

Looking forward to your comments.

cheers
waseem