Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

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Scotters
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Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Scotters »

I have windows 10 on a 2 tb SSD, and I just purchased a 250 GB SSD and a Window 7 64 Bit Home Premium Edition SP 1 disk from Ebay. Now what I want to do is to set up a dual boot, so that I can play BOB 2. 95 percent of my time will still be on windows 10.

I'm probably going to just pay $70 and hire an expert computer tech to do this, but is it really hard to dual boot? And is it fairly easy to switch between the Windows 10 boot and the Windows 7 boot? I am totally lost here, but I guess I really want to play BOB 2, its just been too long!

If needed here are the rest of my specs. Alienware Aurora r7 desktop, upgraded with 850 W power supply, 2080 TI GPU and 32 GB RAM, the original I7 8700 CPU @ 4.3 GHZ. Track IR 5, Thrustmaster Pedals, and even 2 cougar MFDs for Falcon BMS.

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Cherkassov54
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Cherkassov54 »

Hello I did pretty much the same for pretty much the same reasons, almost 3 years ago but I don't recall any issues. I did do it from scratch on a new system which might be slightly different.
I have them on partitions on a single SSD.
When I boot up I get the option to select Win 10 or Win 7 and 20 secs to select, if you don't it defaults to Win 10 (which was installed first I think).

You do have to remember to do updates on both.

Hopefully someone more tech orientated can chip in.

S!

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PV
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by PV »

Not much to it if you're comfortable with editing your BIOS. You want to also check your computer manual,
and make sure, if you have 6GB/s SATA and 3GB/s SATA, that you connect the SSD to a 6GB/s line (SATA3).

Your BIOS should see the new drive even before you put anything on it. You can disconnect the other, existing
boot drive (power off of course) to make sure you're working with the right one, then boot up the win7 disc on
your dvd drive and tell it to format and install on the disc it finds, which will be the SSD. Once done, you can
switch between boots by switching the first boot setting in the BIOS. Newer BIOS's may provide a selection menu
once the two boots are available, so you don't have to actually manually access and edit the BIOS.

I don't have any Win10 dual boots, but I have a couple of machines now with win7 cloned onto an SSD, and I've
left the old drive attached. BIOS from 2010, 2012, don't offer a menu, I had to just edit the boot order to choose
the SSD, it won't boot off the old drive unless the SSD can't be found.

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33lima3
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by 33lima3 »

I had to do this for the second time in about five months over this weekend, because my first Win 7 SSD died after a power loss and could not be resuscitated. Being more confident it would all work, I took the opportunity to get a 240GB SSD this time, rather than the original 120 (making sure I keep the receipt safe, this time!).

As before, I found it do-able but tedious and at times frustrating due to the need to troubleshoot various issues as I went. In my case, this included getting several sims to work again afterwards, because (at least until Win 7 support ends in Jan) I’m booting solely into that. For example this included copying First Eagles and SF2 ‘mod folders’ from a backup to my new Win 7 C: Drive; getting Steam to recognise Cliffs of Dover I had moved onto another drive, separate from my main Steam library; and reinstalling the MS XNA Framework in Win 7 so that Open Rails would work again. And of course re-installing BoB2 and patching it to 2.13.

Advice based on my own experience would be as follows, for whatever it may be worth. I'll probably read it myself if no one else does, if I ever have to do it again :)

Before starting
Get all the kit you need, having done some basic research eg watched videos on installing an SSD (the easy bit). For example, a mounting kit if it’s going into a full size 3.5” drive bay, a SATA cable for data and for power, a molex to SATA adapter cable. Currys PC world in the UK have a kit with all three for just over £5.

Make a CD/DVD with some useful stuff you will need to get your PC fully functional after Win 7 is installed. Essential minimum would be drivers for your network adapter so you can get online in Win 7 (and troubleshoot or download other stuff from the PC you’re working on, without having to boot back into Win 10). Also useful might be the latest drivers for your video card (and if you have USB 3 and an Intel chipset) the Intel USB 3 drivers... https://downloadcenter.intel.com/downlo ... duct=65855 ...I found Win 7 didn’t natively support USB 3 so anything I had plugged into a USB 3 port didn’t work. At least that's how it looked and felt to me. I also put BDG 2.13 onto my ‘Win 7 extras’ DVD, having found it was no longer on the A2A site but on mediafire (thanks again, Fred901!).... viewtopic.php?f=10&t=68054 ...and realised that I had failed to make a backup of it while I had it. You could save this stuff to your Win 10 drive instead of putting it on a DVD, and access it there from Win 7 when it’s installed (drive letters are re-allocated by each O/S) but I preferred to have this on the disc.

Check your mouse is plugged into a USB 2 port, not USB 3, and have your Win 7 product key to hand.

Have a laptop ready so you can troubleshoot stuff that comes up before your Win 7 install is up, running and connected. If a laptop is N/A then another PC, tablet or smartphone, preferably in the same room. Failing any of that, you can always boot temporarily back into Win 10, but that’s much more hassle. Things you might need to troubleshoot include the USB 3 issue (symptoms, USB 3 ports non-functional or bang marks against USB stuff in Device Manager, cure = the aforementioned Intel driver), or Windows 10 not recognising or not allocating a drive letter to the new SSD (cure = finding and using Win 10’s Drive Management utility, IIRC); and setting the BIOS to get the PC to boot in the order you want, first to install Win 7, then to run it. The slip that came with my OEM copy of Win 7 had basic but helpful install advice which included tweaking some BIOS settings before installing (not all of which were described the same way, or appeared to exist, in my UEFI BIOS).

Make sure you have several hours available during which you can sit at the PC with the minimum of interruptions, although you can always divide things into separate sessions – eg installing the SSD; installing Win 7; getting internet and graphics card working in Win 7; letting Win 7 catch up on updates; installing or fixing games so they work in Win 7. The last two can be concurrent.


When installing Win 7
After making sure the BIOS is set to boot from your CD/DVD drive (assuming that’s what you have Win 7 on) and before popping Win 7 into the tray, pull the data plug from your Win 10 drive so there is no chance of messing up that.

SATA cables seem to come loose at the drive end quite readily so a check that all are connected again at that end, before closing the case, is probably a good idea.

First step for me after Win 7 was working was installing my wireless network card’s drivers from the disc I'd saved them to from Win 10, so I could get online in Win 7, without having to boot back into Win 10.

Then I downloaded MS Security Essentials (and later after BoB2 was installed, set it NOT to scan BoB2’s install folder, as I seemed to get in-mission CTDs until I did that).

Then the latest Nvidia drivers.

Then the Intel USB 3 drivers.

Meanwhile, Win 7 is catching up on updates, which I tried to help along by opening Control Panel/Windows Update regularly. Still took several sessions of finding, downloading and installing updates.

Bit of a pain I found it, but I’m hoping that my new install of BoB2 on my new install of Win 7 will now prove as stable as it was first time around, and that this time, my new SSD will last the years it should, not months.
SimHQ Battle of Britain II screenshots thread: http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4481941/1
CombatAce Mission Reports: https://combatace.com/forums/forum/307-mission-reports/

Scotters
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Scotters »

I am having a computer expert install the SSD and Windows 7 for me this week so that I can dual boot! Then I will just need to install the drivers for my warthog hotas, thrustmaster pedals, track ir, and then of course get BOBII installed and set up on Windows 7. I can't wait. What makes a game like Falcon BMS worth learning is that you don't just do missions, you fight in a war, and the same if true for BOB II. Plus, no wwii flight sim that I know of can support the numbers of planes on screen that BOB II does. So while I do like Cliffs of Dover Blitz, and ILS Battle of Stalingrad, its just not as good as BOBII. And after waiting for a few years and hoping for a fix for the Win 10 issues, it seems pretty apparent that it just can't be fixed. So this is is the only way. Most people would thing it would be nuts to do all of this for one game, but I think you guys understand.

I wish A2A would update BOB II some day, and then do the War over Europe, it would be epic!

I hope everything goes well with the installation and that I am up in the air defending England next weekend! Wish me luck, and thank you for all of the advice and tips.

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33lima3
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by 33lima3 »

Yes good luck and good hunting Scotters. I had BoB2 on the shelf for years and ironically it was only tying it out in Win 10 that made me appreciate that as you say, it really is one of those classic sims and a must-have, well worth the effort and modest expense of getting Win 7.

Hopefully you will soon be the Terror of the Huns!

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SimHQ Battle of Britain II screenshots thread: http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4481941/1
CombatAce Mission Reports: https://combatace.com/forums/forum/307-mission-reports/

Scotters
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Scotters »

It didn't work! Separate drives was too tricky, so he tried the partition, and it should have installed Win 7, but there is an issue with the Alienware Aurora R 7, and win 7 would not install. Could be the hardware was too new. He then tried disabling SECRYE BOOT temporarily to see if he could install Win 7. He attempted to install PRE-Windows boot, but there was no response from the USB mouse or keyboard, I guess new mother boards have no native USB drivers in WIN 7 install mode. He then got a blue screen on reboot.

Kevin who runs his own one man company called Personal Touch Computing is fantastic, he has done a lot of work for me in the past. I asked him to post more details here some time, so maybe one of you guys has a solution. My specs are at the very beginning of this thread.

So for now, no BOB II, but everything else works great, and I still have Falcon BMS. And I do have CLOD Blitz to scratch that Battle of Britain itch, but no dynamic campaign, and no 100's of planes in the air. Oh well! :cry:

What is the highest patch version that works in Windows 10? Is it like 2.06 or something? Does it work ok?
Last edited by Scotters on 25 May 2019, 21:48, edited 1 time in total.

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33lima3
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by 33lima3 »

Hardware too new for Win 7 is something I've never had the luxury of worrying about, so I hadn't thought of that and sorry if I misled you! Via Google I found one fix here, though it's a bit involved; there may be others:

https://www.kraftkennedy.com/fixes-inst ... -hardware/

There's also this on Youtube, tho the video isn't playing for me ATM:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3h4rYLBvdU

I never ran the CD version of BoB2 in Win 10 long enough to find out if it ran ok, but per this thread, 2.01 can be made to run in Win 8.1 and it's something added to later updates that broke compatibility with Win 8, which may or may not apply re Win 10:

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=67364

I suppose trial and error will establish which (if any!) BoB2 update will run without CTDs when you quit a mission in Win 10, but 2.01 might be a good place to start. I was certainly able to get BoB2 running fine in Win 10 APART from that CTD, so all the single missions were playable (sometimes even exiting normally). It was campaign missions that regularly CTD'ed before quitting, rendering the campaign playable only as a 2d wargame. But the single missions are so good and so replayable due to the ability to fly in any plane in any formation, that I would still be playing BoB2 in Win 10 if Win 7 hadn't worked for me.
SimHQ Battle of Britain II screenshots thread: http://simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/4481941/1
CombatAce Mission Reports: https://combatace.com/forums/forum/307-mission-reports/

Vox
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Vox »

I understand scotters fustration and I sincerely hope he can get BOB2 running. Until recently I have been playing BOB2 on XP with older patches- v2.13 is a real gem

my experimece. I considered dual boot on my win 10 intel 8th generation build. But after checking found that systems built with 7th generation intel (and newer) processors and newer hardware would likely have win 7 compatibility and driver issues. Ya..It can still work but...

For me a skylake 6th generation processor and compatible MB chipset seemed the best way to go. So, I decided to build a retro-ish win7 64 bit skylake (6th generation) using refurbished and new parts. Skylake are D/C and getting harder to find. I checked critical parts (ie processor, motherboard chipset, graphics card ) for win 7 64 bit compatibility and driver availability. This build plays BoB2 v2.13 and some other older sims like Panzer elite very well. I could have built this cheaper but I want this win7 build around for years to come.

i3-6320 (fast dual core 6th generation), AsRock Z270 MB, 8 gb DDR 4, Samsung SSD, GTX 1060 8g, Cougar HOTAS, Trackir5 , Win7 64 bit Home Pre OEM

Prem Holdaway
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Re: Dual Booting with Windows 7 advice?

Post by Prem Holdaway »

Hopefully this might help.

Windows 7 is a legacy operating system so on any new motherboard the UEFI bias should be set to legacy mode. Also be aware that Windows 10 can sometimes switch it back to default mode.

I would recommend starting with two separate clean discs, whether SSD or standard discs it doesn't matter. Connect one disk to your system and first put Windows 7 on and obviously your Bob 2 with all updates. Next connect your second disc to the system and put Windows 10 on. Do not disconnect your Windows 7 disk while putting Windows 10 on. Make sure that you select the empty disc for Windows 10. Once you have Windows 10 on you can then reboot your system and it should come up with a menu, you can then select Windows 7 or Windows 10.

You can do this by partitioning a larger disc but I have found this not always to be reliable so I now stick to 2 discs.

I personally have been dual booting since windows 98 and millennium.

Good luck.
Prem.

Asus Rog Strix Z690 F WiFi, Intel I9 12900 3200Mhz, 32Gig Mem 5600 DDR5, Asus AMD Radeon RX 6800, 1000W PSU, Windows 11 64bit, TrackIR 5 + Track clip pro, also TrackHat opentrack v3, Hotas Warthog + Viper TQS system & TRP rudder pedals.

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