My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

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Blitzer
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Blitzer »

I had a similar experience in the 172 a few years ago now. If I recall correctly one of the ailerons was stuck and only partially moving, turning in one direction was very restricted but I was able to turn in the opposite direction with more control.

If I remember correctly I was already at an airfield and with a few attempts I was able to judge the arc of my turn so I became aligned with the runway. Using the rudder and restricted control I was able to successfully land.

Needless to say I pretty much only fly Accusim A2A aircraft these day, I love the persistent wear and tear, noticing issues during the walk around or even becoming aware during flight that something is not quite as it should be.

Looking forward to the new accusim features, and think if repair history was recorded that would add another element of immersion. :D

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UKJim
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by UKJim »

I don't like it - start again ;)

Obviously a joke, I'm so excited for this one. It's going to replace my beloved Comanche. I've already started reading a RW POH :)

Thanks for showing us this Scott!

Jim

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ClipperLuna
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by ClipperLuna »

Sheesh, you'd think the mechanic could at least have given you a "hey, nice job bringing her back in one piece with no aileron." :)

UKJim wrote:It's going to replace my beloved Comanche.
Myself as well most likely. Really puts me in a bind. The Comanche's my favorite plane so far; my own has by far the most hours on it of any of my planes. But now we're getting this, complete with gauge failures. Am I going to be able to go back?

Jarek
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Jarek »

Hello, I'm new here, so forgive my ignorance, but somehow "beautiful shape" for general plane condition and failed aileron do not match for me ;-)
Shouldn't this status be updated to something like "grounded, critical failure" after such finding in the hangar?

plicpriest1
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by plicpriest1 »

Jarek wrote:Hello, I'm new here, so forgive my ignorance, but somehow "beautiful shape" for general plane condition and failed aileron do not match for me ;-)
Shouldn't this status be updated to something like "grounded, critical failure" after such finding in the hangar?
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Especially in aircraft acquisitions.

But more specifically, just because a mechanical malfunction has occurred doesn't mean the plane isn't in beautiful shape. Rather it means work must be done (like always). IMHO beautiful shape is a bird with a low to mid time engine, with complete logs, and decent paint/ interior.

n421nj
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by n421nj »

Sometimes parts fail. Could be any reason and on any plane regardless of age or previous condition. That’s the beauty of accusim you think you got a plane in good condition and then whammy!!!
Andrew

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Hook
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Hook »

Jarek wrote:Hello, I'm new here, so forgive my ignorance, but somehow "beautiful shape" for general plane condition and failed aileron do not match for me ;-)
Shouldn't this status be updated to something like "grounded, critical failure" after such finding in the hangar?
I agree Jarek, and that was a good catch. I didn't notice the "beautiful shape" originally.

I don't think I'd want to be flying, or flying in, an aircraft with a known mechanical defect that could kill me. I'm going to assume that the next pre-flight inspection would show the failure and you wouldn't try flying the plane that way. Or you could skip the pre-flight. This gives you a good reason to perform it.

But one thing is for sure: AccuSim keeps getting better and better. :)

Hook

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Scott - A2A
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Scott - A2A »

The mechanic is speaking to the overall condition of the airplane. So it basically is saying "Aside from the broken aileron, this aircraft is in beautiful shape." If you said something like "this aircraft is grounded because the aileron is jammed" that tells you basically one thing, which is less information. The way we do it now accurately summarizes the complete condition of the airplane. Telling you not just about the aileron, but the entire airplane.

Scott.
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Hook
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Hook »

Apparently the mechanic is talking about the general condition of the engine. What are the possibilities besides "beautiful shape"?

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UKJim
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by UKJim »

ClipperLuna wrote:Myself as well most likely. Really puts me in a bind. The Comanche's my favorite plane so far; my own has by far the most hours on it of any of my planes. But now we're getting this, complete with gauge failures. Am I going to be able to go back?
Completely the same - I stream on Twitch and 90% of my time is spent in the Comanche. I have always loved the low wing even with the limited visibility during VFR.

The other thing that attracted me to the Comanche is the cockpit - I really liked the layout and so I never looked back. But obviously the V-tail Cockpit is VERY unique with that joint up yoke design and that wood trim, so classy :)

No doubt in my mind the V-tail Will replace my Comanche with it's style and extra features.

If you like GA flying and A2A planes feel free to register on Twitch and get following my channel ;) You can also use the phone app too to watch the stream. Link is in my signature below.

Cheers
Jim

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AKar
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by AKar »

BTW, it would be very interesting to learn more about gauge simulation. I remember discussions before which suggested that the simulation of even properly functioning gauges goes deeper than before. Also, as they apparently can fail, it would be interesting to learn in which ways they might do it in the simulator. Can they, for instance, present false information if such failure mode makes sense for the instrument in question instead of simply shutting off?

To point out one thing I look forward the most in this release, it would be this enhanced simulation of cockpit instrumentation and avionics. Because no matter how Accu-Sim, our gauges have been mostly lifeless, precision things that always indicate properly, kind of like an ammo counter in a first-person shooter. :mrgreen: In real life, failures of the flight controls for instance in a properly maintained and pre-flighted airplane are extremely rare events, however, issues with various gauges are almost routinely encountered if speaking of any sizable fleet of aircraft having their dashboards peppered with analog instrumentation. Further, what an average Joe may not fully appreciate is that any instrumentation, even when working correctly, only provides a value ± some error. If you took GA airplane fuel gauges as an example, the ± can be quite significant in percentage. But even more precise instruments, such as altimeters, air speed indicators etc. are only good to certain confidence. The same goes with the avionics, ADF in particular, but VOR and DME as well - even GPS. Even "perfect" attitude indicators develop errors due to their self-erecting function in anything but precisely straight and level flight.

-Esa

Jarek
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Jarek »

Thank you all for your answers. Interesting discussion. I got logic for the plane condition.
What I see on this clipboard is basically the list of risks, so you as an owner has to assess and decide if you repair or not. Please correct me if I'm wrong but I believe your preflight inspection was ok and if you do inspection before this flight, the same results would be there.
Now as the risk has materialized in this flight, the plane status does not reflect that, this is what I'm maybe missing here after full inspection.

I found a statement in official papers (FAA order 8130.2J) for small planes:
The inspections must be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records showing the following, or a similarly worded, statement: “I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on [insert date] per the [insert either: scope and detail of part 43, appendix D; or manufacturer’s inspection procedures] and was found to be in a condition for safe operation.”
Personally I would not sign this after such discovery of aileron hinge damage ;-)

Anyway, the beauty of A2A planes is that it's not just a nice airplane sim, but also goes into area of making business decisions. I can see the Bo will take me to the next level, as for now the only decision I can made is to refuel or not as I
try make notes how much fuels was in the tanks after each flight.

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AKar
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by AKar »

Jarek wrote:I found a statement in official papers (FAA order 8130.2J) for small planes:
The inspections must be recorded in the aircraft maintenance records showing the following, or a similarly worded, statement: “I certify that this aircraft has been inspected on [insert date] per the [insert either: scope and detail of part 43, appendix D; or manufacturer’s inspection procedures] and was found to be in a condition for safe operation.”
Personally I would not sign this after such discovery of aileron hinge damage ;-)
FAA 8130.2J applies to "...policies and procedures for issuing airworthiness certificates, export certificates of airworthiness, and special flight authorizations for aircraft." It does not consider regular preventive maintenance scheduled inspections or other routine maintenance performed on the aircraft.

However, all the work and maintenance inspections performed on an aircraft is to be signed off as well. Under EASA, it is mandatory to include a statement, not sure if that is the case under FAA, but the description of the work performed must be included in both jurisdictions. Now, a very important consideration (that is certainly beyond the scope of flight sim!) is that the aircraft maintenance release only considers the work performed, and does not consider the overall condition of the aircraft. Under EASA, the maintenance release statement precisely reflects this by stating that it "Certifies that the work specified, except as otherwise specified, was carried out in accordance with Part-145 and in respect to that work the aircraft is considered ready for release to service".

I of course don't know yet how the inspection button works and relates to the mechanic's comments, if it needs to be pressed for this statement to show and so on. Yet, it would be all possible in real life that an aircraft has a maintenance release but having something seriously wrong in it. Say, you brought the plane in for the mechanic to add some oil, or change a tire or to swap a faulty instrument. His/her maintenance release certainly wouldn't cover if there was a developing crack in the wing spar. Obviously though the maintenance organisation/personnel is obliged to not release the aircraft into service if they note or otherwise know there is an existing defect that endangers safe flight, however they are not in particular responsible of detecting such if it is outside the work that was carried out.

-Esa

Buffy Foster

Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by Buffy Foster »

I want this sooooooo much! \o/

(and the paint kit...)

patful
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Re: My ailerons just jammed during a test flight...

Post by patful »

Buffy Foster wrote:(and the paint kit...)
You never know, maybe a purple livery is included.

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