A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

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Archive88
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A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Archive88 »

Probably asked elsewhere, but I can't find it.
My favorite aircraft = A2A Comanche 250. Will it fly as well in the new FS 2020 as in the original FSX accelerated version?
-=dcp=-

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cristi.neagu
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by cristi.neagu »

No. Not at all. It will be better.

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Lewis - A2A
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Lewis - A2A »

Our first MSFS release is looking to be the Comanche 250! 8)

thanks,
Lewis - A2A
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cristi.neagu
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by cristi.neagu »

Lewis - A2A wrote: 15 Apr 2021, 15:46 Our first MSFS release is looking to be the Comanche 250! 8)

thanks,
Lewis - A2A
I can't wait! It would be great if we could get a vague timeline, at least. But at the same time, looking at the development progress made by Asobo, it wouldn't surprise me to know that even A2A would really like a timeline on the Comanche :D

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Lewis - A2A
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Lewis - A2A »

Something like that :mrgreen:
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Archive88
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Archive88 »

Ahhh,\...not sure this answers my question, folks.
Will my A2A Comanche 250 fly well in MSFS 2020?

Dogsbody55
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Dogsbody55 »

Lewis - A2A wrote: 15 Apr 2021, 16:27 Something like that :mrgreen:
Remind me never to play cards with you :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :lol:


Cheers,
Mike
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MkIV Hvd
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by MkIV Hvd »

Archive88 wrote: 16 Apr 2021, 22:25 Ahhh,\...not sure this answers my question, folks.
Will my A2A Comanche 250 fly well in MSFS 2020?
Your question was answered by cristi.neagu in the first response to your post...

Cheers,
Rob
Rob Wilkinson
A2A: Civilian Mustang, T-6, Bonanza, Comanche, Cub, C182, Spitfire, P-40, Cherokee, P-51 - VATSIM P4 and some other stuff...

marez
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by marez »

I doubt it. All planes in msfs2020 fly awful. The flight model of msfs2020 is a joke and no developer has been able to improve the performance of their pay planes. The only solution is that a2a can import his own flight model and this does not depend at all of the msfs modern flight model. I don't know if this is possible

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cristi.neagu
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by cristi.neagu »

marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 I doubt it.
If A2A release the Comanche for FS2020 it will be up to their usual standards, i'm sure. So there is no reason to doubt that an FS2020 Comanche will be as good or even better than the previous version. The only thing you can possibly doubt is if they will be able to release it or not.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 All planes in msfs2020 fly awful.
Compared to what? The default FSX flight model? I beg to differ.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 The flight model of msfs2020 is a joke and no developer has been able to improve the performance of their pay planes.
Both of those claims are patently wrong. You aren't comparing flight models, you are comparing the handling of default FS2020 aircraft against the top of the line GA simulations produced by A2A. Is that really a fair and meaningful comparison?
Also, flightsim.to has improvement mods for almost every single default FS2020 aircraft, considerably improving everything from flight dynamics, to performance, to system complexity. Not to mention the JustFlight Arrow which manages to be quite enjoyable despite being completely built inside the default flight model. Even Carenado aircraft fly way better than they ever did in FSX or P3D.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 The only solution is that a2a can import his own flight model and this does not depend at all of the msfs modern flight model.
Well, what do you think Accusim is?

There's a lot wrong with FS2020, i give you that. But there is no reason to invent issues that simply aren't there. Sounds to me like you haven't spent any time at all, if any, flying in FS2020.

marez
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by marez »

cristi.neagu wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 14:58
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 I doubt it.
If A2A release the Comanche for FS2020 it will be up to their usual standards, i'm sure. So there is no reason to doubt that an FS2020 Comanche will be as good or even better than the previous version. The only thing you can possibly doubt is if they will be able to release it or not.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 All planes in msfs2020 fly awful.
Compared to what? The default FSX flight model? I beg to differ.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 The flight model of msfs2020 is a joke and no developer has been able to improve the performance of their pay planes.
Both of those claims are patently wrong. You aren't comparing flight models, you are comparing the handling of default FS2020 aircraft against the top of the line GA simulations produced by A2A. Is that really a fair and meaningful comparison?
Also, flightsim.to has improvement mods for almost every single default FS2020 aircraft, considerably improving everything from flight dynamics, to performance, to system complexity. Not to mention the JustFlight Arrow which manages to be quite enjoyable despite being completely built inside the default flight model. Even Carenado aircraft fly way better than they ever did in FSX or P3D.
marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 The only solution is that a2a can import his own flight model and this does not depend at all of the msfs modern flight model.
Well, what do you think Accusim is?

There's a lot wrong with FS2020, i give you that. But there is no reason to invent issues that simply aren't there. Sounds to me like you haven't spent any time at all, if any, flying in FS2020.
I mean this when I doubt.

Comparing for example the flyingiron spitfire for msfs2020 and the one for xplane. Same developer and price, different platform. Airplanes with conventional landing gear do not bounce if a hard landing is made with the front wheels, they behave as if had a tricycle landing gear.

I have the carenado m20 for msfs2020 and you can do things that are physically impossible like for example make a sharp turns and do not cause a stall, the plane only lose altitud or If you violently pull the yoke to the maximum instead of stalling the plane you make a loop even at low speeds.

You're right. I can't stand it for more than 10 minutes, it's boring because it's unrealistic. Even the short time I use it I prefer to use the legacy flight model, it feels better.

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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by MarcE »

marez wrote: 17 Apr 2021, 11:34 I doubt it. All planes in msfs2020 fly awful. The flight model of msfs2020 is a joke and no developer has been able to improve the performance of their pay planes. The only solution is that a2a can import his own flight model and this does not depend at all of the msfs modern flight model. I don't know if this is possible
Different is not necessarily worse ^^ Like Cristi said above A2A have circumvented the flight dynamics of FSX and P3D and they will continue to do that in MSFS2020. However I strongly disagree that the flight models were "awful". They do have flaws indeed, a big problem currently is the aileron/yaw behaviour and generally the effect of the rudder of the default flight models. Apart from that there are just some minor issues. But look at it from A to Z: Taxi with realistic power settings. Takeoff without forcing the airplane in the air, it will fly by itself when it's fast enough. good (not yet perfect) thermal/turbulence effects in low altitudes at departure. Fly the airplane through a dynamic atmosphere. Descend and approach with realistic power settings, no 60-70% required in the Cessna with flaps down as in FSX. Try to stall and spin a default airplane in P3D and then do the same in MSFS. The physics and flight dynamics in MSFS are much better than in any sim before. As said, there are flaws and problems to be solved. But even ATSimulations have already resolved these issues with their Piaggio 149, the rudder behaves nicely there. It's all about the will and skill of the developers. And if a Carenado biplane behaves erratically on the ground it's totally up to the devs to do something against it, apparently it's possible.

A2A will have their own environment anyway called Accusim, so whatever they will release into MSFS it will couple amazing Accusim physics and systems with the best of MSFS.

Jarek
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by Jarek »

MarcE wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 03:37 It's all about the will and skill of the developers.
Period. So true. But there's a threat - so called "mass market", you can find some "devs" and "community mods" and when you look under the hood, basically there's no math behind changes they do, but you still have 1000's of people saying "yes, now it feels so good!". One example I can give you is increasing beta for constant speed prop, so governor will never kick in, because people were complaining that it engine overspeeds on takeoff and prop which in real life has over 40lbs gets inertia of piece of cartoon because "yeah, now I have instant power!". They are now happy about it and this leaves no room for discussion. Sad, because becomes is a video game at the end, not a simulator.

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AKar
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by AKar »

Jarek wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 06:14
MarcE wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 03:37 It's all about the will and skill of the developers.
Period. So true. But there's a threat - so called "mass market", you can find some "devs" and "community mods" and when you look under the hood, basically there's no math behind changes they do, but you still have 1000's of people saying "yes, now it feels so good!". One example I can give you is increasing beta for constant speed prop, so governor will never kick in, because people were complaining that it engine overspeeds on takeoff and prop which in real life has over 40lbs gets inertia of piece of cartoon because "yeah, now I have instant power!". They are now happy about it and this leaves no room for discussion. Sad, because becomes is a video game at the end, not a simulator.
Indeed. Why spend all the time and effort studying, recording and recreating what something really is like and how it behaves, when gaming community will simply tell when something feels "better" or "just right". Sad it is, but I've seen all too many watered-down simulations, and/or unrealistic sound environments, and so on, apparently for no other reason than this.

-Esa

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DHenriques_
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Re: A2A Comanche and MS FS 2020

Post by DHenriques_ »

AKar wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 07:44
Jarek wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 06:14
MarcE wrote: 18 Apr 2021, 03:37 It's all about the will and skill of the developers.
Period. So true. But there's a threat - so called "mass market", you can find some "devs" and "community mods" and when you look under the hood, basically there's no math behind changes they do, but you still have 1000's of people saying "yes, now it feels so good!". One example I can give you is increasing beta for constant speed prop, so governor will never kick in, because people were complaining that it engine overspeeds on takeoff and prop which in real life has over 40lbs gets inertia of piece of cartoon because "yeah, now I have instant power!". They are now happy about it and this leaves no room for discussion. Sad, because becomes is a video game at the end, not a simulator.
Indeed. Why spend all the time and effort studying, recording and recreating what something really is like and how it behaves, when gaming community will simply tell when something feels "better" or "just right". Sad it is, but I've seen all too many watered-down simulations, and/or unrealistic sound environments, and so on, apparently for no other reason than this.

-Esa
I remember during our betas a long discussion Scott and I had one night on the phone concerning how we could replicate for realism how a prop "unloads" as a takeoff progresses.
I have never in all the years I've been working with realism transfer on simulation seen a developer other than us, even at study level, who delved this deeply into putting realism and depth of fidelity into a flight model.
Dudley Henriques

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