Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

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Lofty Anstruther
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Lofty Anstruther »

Hi Buddye, hope you had a great Thanksgiving.

As I am W10 and you are W11 would you like me to work through the various compatibility modes and report back on each as I work my way through them? Failing that I guess we could allocate specific compatibility modes that we will each test & report on and compare our results.

Cheers

Lofty
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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Lofty Anstruther wrote: 26 Nov 2023, 13:52 Hi Buddye, hope you had a great Thanksgiving.

As I am W10 and you are W11 would you like me to work through the various compatibility modes and report back on each as I work my way through them? Failing that I guess we could allocate specific compatibility modes that we will each test & report on and compare our results.
We had a great Thanksgiving with family and friends.

Good question? I have been thinking about a good approach. Today I am feeling that the Compatibility Mode may be individual PC specific. If I am correct, then us testing would be interesting but not really helpful to other BOBII users. BOBII user will need to test the different Compatibility modes themselves and pick one that minimizes both 3D and ALT-X CTD.

I think our job will be to specify what needs to be added to the BOBII install. It seems to me that so far W10 and W11 seem to benefit from the same additions to the BOBII installs which is good, IMHO.

Any thought on this?
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi guys,

I got this from Microfoft CoPilot:

Ntdll.dll crashes can occur when the ntdll.dll file, which contains NT kernel functions for the Windows operating system, fails to execute properly. This issue can be caused by various factors, including simultaneous access by different programs, generic corruption errors, outdated operating systems, faulty applications, or corrupted files. Here are some steps you can take to address this problem:

System File Checker (SFC) Scan: Run an SFC scan to repair any corrupted system files. Open a Command Prompt as an administrator and type:

sfc /scannow

Antivirus Scan: Perform an antivirus scan to check for any malicious software that might be causing the issue.

Driver Updates: Update your drivers, including video drivers, as outdated drivers can sometimes lead to crashes.

Application Reinstallation: If the issue persists, consider reinstalling the application that triggers the crash.

DLL Replacement: Replace the ntdll.dll file from a trustworthy source. You can copy it from another computer running the same version and edition of the Windows operating system.

Remember to consult with the software developer if the problem persists, as they might have additional insights or solutions. Keep in mind that ntdll.dll is essential for the normal functioning of the Windows OS 123. If you encounter any further difficulties, don’t hesitate to seek professional assistance. 🛠️

BTW, I did a repeat sfc /scannow today and I had corrupted files. Go Figure? We might want to do a scan before we test until Microsoft can fix this problem. I am not sure when I did this scan the last time (3 weeks, maybe).
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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Lofty Anstruther
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Lofty Anstruther »

Hi Buddye,
I have run SFC and like you, some corrupt files were found and repaired. I will run this before every test session, (next one tomorrow hopefully).

Cheers
Lofty
"Home and tea. For once you deserve it, well done everybody"

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Lofty Anstruther
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Lofty Anstruther »

Hi, Here are the results of my latest test session.

30/11/23 BoB 2.13 + 4gb patch + reran dx2010 patch installer + DX64 + DX86. Ran System File Checker no issues

All tests with my normal graphics (Use desktop resolution = off 1920x1080x32@60) and other settings.

Restored XP SP2 Compatibility mode in Properties Icon.

Test 01
IA Landing – Landed, Switched off - Alt+X – Back to game menu page = ok.

Test 02
IA – Lone Fighter v’s Lone Bomber. Interception made in thick dusk and overcast conditions plus flak.
Landed, switched off Alt+X – CTD

------------ Begin of section written with bob.exe, Build/Rebuild all date: Oct 15 2015 06:45:38 ---------------------------
bob.exe caused a EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION in module ntdll.dll at 0023:77BEF603, RtlDllShutdownInProgress()+163 byte(s)
Exception handler called in int CMIGApp::Run().
Write to location 00000014 caused an access violation.
Code: ff 40 14 8b 1e 89 5c 24 50 8d 64 24 00 e8 7b 46

Disabled Steam. (which was leftover from a previous gaming session).

Test 03
IA – Lone Fighter v’s Lone Bomber. Interception made in good conditions plus flak.
Landed, switched off Alt+X – CTD

------------ Begin of section written with bob.exe, Build/Rebuild all date: Oct 15 2015 06:45:38 ---------------------------
bob.exe caused a EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION in module ntdll.dll at 0023:77BEF603, RtlDllShutdownInProgress()+163 byte(s)
Exception handler called in int CMIGApp::Run().
Write to location 00000014 caused an access violation.
Code: ff 40 14 8b 1e 89 5c 24 50 8d 64 24 00 e8 7b 46

Disabled Compatibility mode in Properties Icon.

Test 04
IA – Lone Fighter v’s Lone Bomber. Interception made in rain clouds plus flak.
Landed, switched off Alt+X – CTD

------------ Begin of section written with bob.exe, Build/Rebuild all date: Oct 15 2015 06:45:38 ---------------------------
bob.exe caused a EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION in module ntdll.dll at 0023:77BEF603, RtlDllShutdownInProgress()+163 byte(s)
Exception handler called in int CMIGApp::Run().
Write to location 00000014 caused an access violation.
Code: ff 40 14 8b 1e 89 5c 24 50 8d 64 24 00 e8 7b 46

Restarted Computer

Test 05
IA – Lone Fighter v’s Lone Bomber. Interception made in good conditions. Bomber exploded. Immediate Alt+X whilst still in the air – Back to game menu page = ok.

Test 06
IA – Lone Fighter v’s Lone Bomber. Interception made in good conditions. Bomber exploded. Landed, switched off Alt+X– Back to game menu page = ok

It may be significant that things seemed to improve after I restarted my computer which I had not dome after I ran the system file checker(?).
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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Thanks Lofty,

The alt-X ctd (ntdll.dll) are a big issue. It was interesting that when you restarted the PC you had two good missions. I hate to be dependent on Microsoft to fix the ntdll.dll CTD.

Maybe we should always restart the PC Before our testing and after our Procedures (running SFC, rerunning directx_jun2910_redist,exe, Microsoft.DirectX.x86, and Microsoft.DirectX.x64, etc...).

I think we are dealing with corruption during BOBII testing.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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Lofty Anstruther
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Lofty Anstruther »

Hi Buddye,
I have been trying to educate myself a little about what ntdll.dll is and following the test that I reported yesterday I found the following website. In its guidance regarding 'Fixing ntdll.dll Errors' it specifies that after both scans (DISM and SFC) are completed, the computer should be restarted in order to apply any changes. This is consistent with the experience of my most recent test and your observation that we should restart our computers after running one of the various utilities listed in your post.

https://malwaretips.com/blogs/ntdll-dll ... ix-errors/

Cheers
Lofty

PS If we are dealing with corruption, is there any chance that we will get a 'brown envelope? :wink:
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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi Lofty,

Thanks for the link and info.

I reran dism online/ cleanup-image/ restorehealth/ and sfc /scannow and restated my PC.

I also reinstalled Microsoft C++ Redistributable, reran dx2010 patch installer + DX64 + DX86, and reinstalled net framework 3.5 and restarted my PC.

Testing now and report tomorrow.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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Lofty Anstruther
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Lofty Anstruther »

Hi Buddye,
Good luck! I hope to do some testing tomorrow.

Microsoft C++ Redistributable is new to me. I have just downloaded a file called vc_redist.x64 from the Microsoft download centre but not installed it. I'm not sure if that is what you are referring to and if it is, do you think I should install it?
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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi Lofty, we may not need it but it will not hurt your install. I installed all versions. This data is from Microsoft co-pilot.

Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable is a package that installs the runtime components of Visual C++ libraries on your computer. These components are required for many applications and programs, especially games, that are developed using Visual C++ tools. The redistributable package ensures that these applications can run smoothly on your system, even if you don’t have Visual Studio or Visual C++ installed.

There are different versions of Visual C++ Redistributable packages, depending on the version of Visual C++ that was used to create the applications. For example, Visual Studio 2015, 2017, 2019, and 2022 use the same redistributable package, which you can download from the Microsoft website. However, older versions of Visual Studio, such as 2013, 2012, 2010, 2008, and 2005, have their own redistributable packages, which you can also find on the Microsoft website.

You may see multiple Visual C++ Redistributable packages installed on your computer, because some applications may require different versions of the redistributable package to run properly. You can view the list of installed packages in the Control Panel, under Programs and Features. You can also repair, uninstall, or update the packages from there, if needed. However, you should be careful not to remove any packages that are required by your applications, as this may cause them to malfunction or crash. If you are not sure which packages are needed, it is best to leave them as they are.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi Lofty,

As shown in Contrl Panel > Programs and Features, I have installed all Misrosoft Visual C++ Redistributable 2005 through 2022. 13 total installs, dates- 2005,2008, 2010,2012,2013,2015-2022.

This is the Microsoft link: https://github.com/MicrosoftDocs/cpp-do ... -redist.md

My testing results was mixed but good:

10 Turkey Shoot missions - no problems
10 Lone Bomber and lone fighter - No problems
1 End of the Defiant, no 3D problems, alt-X CTD.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

Prem Holdaway
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Prem Holdaway »

Hi Buddye, hi lofty,

Apologies for not being around the last two weeks, but I have been rather involved in replacing my hi-fi system. On moving from London four years ago. I could not fit my old system in this bungalow. So now my daughter is the proud owner of my old system and I have finally decided it was time to replace it three weeks ago. I'm afraid it has caused me a bit of a hassle. Needless to say I haven't done any testing for the last two weeks, although I have still been trying to get access to the BobII code in the mornings. For you, Buddye. Scott has PM'd me and has passed me his email address. So I suspect he is going to try and get something working. So far I have tried everything in the Git menu. No problem in logging in to the server but no options to enter the username or password. So I now need to wait on Scott.

Regards,
Prem.

Asus Rog Strix Z690 F WiFi, Intel I9 12900 3200Mhz, 32Gig Mem 5600 DDR5, Asus AMD Radeon RX 6800, 1000W PSU, Windows 11 64bit, TrackIR 5 + Track clip pro, also TrackHat opentrack v3, Hotas Warthog + Viper TQS system & TRP rudder pedals.

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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi Prem,

NO problem as real life for all of us takes priority. No worries!

We are at a point in our testing where we need to look at our progress, and issues so we can determine if we have a workable path forward.

I will try to pull together a summary of what we have discovered and what we need to focus on.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

Prem Holdaway
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Prem Holdaway »

Hi Buddye,

I know you are going to eventually need to collect all the tests together. Please don't specially rush it for me as I have been reading all the posts, even though I did not have the time to answer them.

At the moment. I am waiting and hoping that Scott has a workaround to be able to enter the passwords via visual studio. That is all that is stopping me from accessing the code and hopefully compiling it. As I have read through each of the postings I get more hopeful that it will just be a recompile. He says hopefully!

Regards,
Prem.

Asus Rog Strix Z690 F WiFi, Intel I9 12900 3200Mhz, 32Gig Mem 5600 DDR5, Asus AMD Radeon RX 6800, 1000W PSU, Windows 11 64bit, TrackIR 5 + Track clip pro, also TrackHat opentrack v3, Hotas Warthog + Viper TQS system & TRP rudder pedals.

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Buddye
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Re: Testing BOBII on W11with 2.13

Post by Buddye »

Hi Prem, Lofty, Vox, Fred and any other BOBII Users

I am slowly coming to the conclusion that BOBII's CTD issue is a Microsoft OS issue that started with W8. It has continued with W10 and W11. The issue is that key OS files are corrupted when BOBII runs under W8, W11 and W10. These are key files (ntdll.dll, d3d9.dll ,kernelbase.dll) that can be fixed by reinstalling or with OS scan tools ( dism an sfc). Even if they are fixed when BOBII runs these programs become re-corrupted.

It is not a BOBII code problem, and it cannot be fixed by recompiling BOBII code, IMHO. If we could recompile BOBII on a late model MVS compiler it "might" work but the effort to accomplish this is very large as interfaces and changes will require code changes.

I have got my W11 BOBII running good but not perfect. When BOBII CTD, I rerun the tools and run until the key files are corrupted again.

Microsoft is aware they have a ntdll.dll problem. I am not sure if they will fix it or if they even understand what the problem is. I am not sure why BOBII V2.01 runs perfectly on W8, W10 and W11 and all other BOBII versions (V2.01 through V2.13) CTD. My W7 BOBII V2.13 runs perfectly.

Anyone with an opinion, please comment here.

I plan to write up all the tools that we are using to reinstall the key files when CTD occur in the key files.
Buddye

Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro

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